Before
THE TOBYHANNA TOWNSHIP BOARD OF SUPERVISORS
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In Re: Regular Business Meeting
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Tobyhanna Township Government Center Building
State Avenue
Pocono Pines, Pennsylvania 18350
Monday, June 8, 2009 beginning at 7:02 p.m.
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PRESENT: JOHN E. KERRICK, Chairperson
HEIDI A. PICKARD, Vice-Chairperson
DONALD J. MOYER, Board Member
ANNE LAMBERTON, Board Member
JAMIE B. KEENER, Board Member
PATRICK M. ARMSTRONG, ESQUIRE, Solicitor
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_________________________ _______________________
PANKO REPORTING
537 Sarah Street, 2nd Floor
Stroudsburg, Pennsylvania 18360
(570) 421-3620
2
INDEX TO EXHIBITS
BOARD FOR
EXHIBIT I.D.
1...PennDOT Accident Report...................10
2...Summary of Annual Reports from 2004
Through 2008..............................12
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3
1 MR. KERRICK: I'd like to welcome
2 everyone here this evening for the regular business
3 meeting for the board of supervisors, June 8.
4 Call the meeting to order with a
5 Pledge of Allegiance, please.
6 (Pledge of Allegiance was recited.)
7 MR. KERRICK: First order of
8 business, we have announcements.
9 MS. PICKARD: Okay. We had an
10 executive session May 13, 2:45 to 3 p.m., and we
11 had an executive session 6/8, the time of 6:30 to
12 7:00, for litigation purposes. And we wanted to
13 thank Richard Henry Construction in conjunction
14 with Sealey Landscaping and Hoffman Excavating for
15 their help in landscaping the inner road over by
16 the Pennmart.
17 MR. KERRICK: Next item for board
18 approval, consider the minutes of April 13, 2009,
19 regular business meeting; and May 27, 2009, special
20 meeting.
21 What's the board's pleasure?
22 MS. PICKARD: I make a motion that
23 we approve the April 13, 2009 regular business
24 meeting minutes and May 27, 2009 special meeting
25 minutes.
4
1 MR. KEENER: Second.
2 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
3 Questions or comments from the
4 board?
5 Questions or comments from the
6 public on the motion?
7 Call the vote.
8 Jamie?
9 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
10 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
11 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
12 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
13 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
14 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
15 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
16 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
17 Motion carried.
18 Next item on our agenda, consider
19 the treasurer's report dated June 8, 2009. Total
20 amount for board approval, $148,266.72.
21 MR. KEENER: I make a motion we
22 approve the treasurer's report in the amount of
23 $148,266.72.
24 MR. MOYER: Second.
25 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
5
1 Questions or comments?
2 Questions or comments from the
3 public?
4 Call the vote.
5 Jamie?
6 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
7 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
8 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
9 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
10 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
11 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
12 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
13 MR. KERRICK: Motion carried.
14 Next item, solicitor's report.
15 MR. ARMSTRONG: I got a few things
16 in my report this evening. The first one looks
17 like the future land use map. It's my
18 understanding that the township has been
19 considering the future land use map that goes with
20 the regional comprehensive plan and some possible
21 revisions to it for some time. I think last year's
22 planning commission was reviewing it and I think
23 the board of supervisors has recently been looking
24 at it and reviewing it and making some
25 recommendations with respect to some changes.
6
1 Obviously any changes to it would be
2 required to have a public hearing. I don't know if
3 it's in a form and the board's pleasure to
4 advertise this for a public hearing yet or not.
5 MR. KEENER: Yeah, we had discussed
6 it at the work session last week and I would make a
7 motion that we advertise the current draft of the
8 future land use plan for public hearing.
9 MS. PICKARD: I'll second the
10 motion.
11 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
12 Questions or comments from the
13 board?
14 Questions or comments from the
15 public?
16 Yes, sir.
17 MR. THOMAS CAMPSON: Tom Campson.
18 Is this regarding the Ordinance 481?
19 MR. ARMSTRONG: This is Ordinance
20 480 and 481, and those are zoning amendments.
21 480 -- proposed Ordinance 480 is the rezoning
22 ordinance and proposed Ordinance 481 --
23 MR. THOMAS CAMPSON: This motion --
24 MR. ARMSTRONG: This is in relation
25 to the township's regional comprehensive plan.
7
1 MR. THOMAS CAMPSON: Okay. I'm
2 sorry. I apologize.
3 MR. ARMSTRONG: That's okay.
4 MR. KERRICK: Any other questions?
5 Call the vote.
6 Jamie?
7 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
8 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
9 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
10 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
11 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
12 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
13 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
14 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
15 Motion carried.
16 MR. ARMSTRONG: The only thing I'll
17 add with that is, it's required that we provide a
18 copy to the county 45 days in advance, so this will
19 not be a public hearing at your July meeting, it
20 will most likely be at your August meeting.
21 MS. PICKARD: And regional comp, is
22 it 30 days for the municipality or just notify
23 everybody together?
24 MR. ARMSTRONG: Right.
25 The second item under my agenda is
8
1 proposed Ordinance 480, the Pocono Manor rezoning
2 ordinance. I think everyone's pretty much familiar
3 with this ordinance. It's a proposed rezoning of
4 the township zoning map. It's been before this
5 board for a few months now, two public hearings.
6 This evening is a continuation of a
7 public hearing from last meeting, May 11, 2009. At
8 that meeting we continued the public hearing for
9 further consideration of the board at tonight's
10 meeting. I believe the board wanted to look at
11 some additional information particularly concerning
12 potential accidents at the road near the property.
13 As said on the record at the
14 previous public hearing in May, the proposed
15 ordinance was advertised appropriately pursuant to
16 the MPC with the Pocono Record. It was advertised
17 on April 27 and May 4 of 2009 for the public
18 hearing on May 11.
19 At that May 11 hearing we took
20 significant public comment and continued the
21 hearing until this evening. The property was
22 posted prior to that May 11 hearing and a
23 certificate -- or a certification from the township
24 zoning officer evidenced that it was posted
25 appropriately.
9
1 This is a public hearing that has
2 been continued for this evening. I will say for
3 purposes of the public, we've taken public comment
4 on this for at least two public hearings for this
5 particular ordinance extensively. I think the two
6 prior public hearings probably went in excess of an
7 hour, hour and a half. To the extent that there's
8 any public comment tonight, the board will request
9 that it not be any repetition of what we've already
10 heard for the past two or three hearings before
11 this board.
12 And just briefly to go over again
13 what this ordinance is, it's an ordinance that
14 would be rezoning the parcel identified as
15 19/634400958628 on the proposed rezoning map that's
16 attached to the ordinance and identified as
17 Exhibit B. It contains approximately 193 acres.
18 It would be changing that parcel that's currently
19 zoned RR, rural residential, to C, commercial. And
20 with that, we can continue moving forward with the
21 public hearing.
22 Is there anything from the board at
23 this time?
24 MR. KEENER: Yeah, I'll start. It
25 was discussed at the prior hearing, there was
10
1 questions regarding the number of accidents on
2 Sullivan Trail in the vicinity of the property. We
3 did contact PennDOT and got an accident report for
4 the years 2004 through 2008, it's a five-year
5 period.
6 They reported one minor injury, a
7 crash, and eight property-damage-only crashes for a
8 total of nine. The description: Seven of the nine
9 were hit fixed object, one was a noncollision
10 accident, and one was an unknown accident. And
11 that's the PennDOT report for the past five years,
12 for 2004 through 2008.
13 Do you want to enter that into the
14 record?
15 MR. ARMSTRONG: We'll mark this as
16 B-1.
17 (PennDOT Accident Report was marked
18 for identification by Mr. Armstrong as Board
19 Exhibit No. 1.)
20 MR. KEENER: I guess I had also
21 discussed the fiscal impact of residential verses
22 nonresidential properties and I also think I
23 referenced the Monroe County Planning Commission's
24 annual report from 2008 that talked about the tax
25 deficit for development projects in Tobyhanna
11
1 Township. I've compiled a summary of their annual
2 reports from 2004 through 2008, and I'll read the
3 numbers relative to the tax benefit or deficit in
4 each of the years for the plans that were
5 submitted.
6 In 2004 Tobyhanna Township
7 experienced a negative $34,686 deficit. In 2005 it
8 was a $224,854 deficit. 2006 it was a $348,980
9 deficit. 2007 was the only year in the past five
10 that was actually a tax benefit with $517,836.
11 That was primarily as a result of the Arcadia
12 project and New Ventures Park which hasn't been
13 built at this point. And 2008 was a $196,696
14 deficit.
15 So over the five-year period we've
16 experienced in the plans that have been submitted a
17 $287,000 -- 287,380 tax deficit as a result of the
18 plans that have been submitted. To break that down
19 between residential and nonresidential over the
20 five-year period, the residential has experienced a
21 $963,491 deficit while the nonresidential, which is
22 commercial industrial, has experienced a $676,111
23 credit. Again, the net result is $287,380 deficit.
24 And I'd like to enter that into the
25 record as well.
12
1 MR. ARMSTRONG: I'll mark that as
2 B-2.
3 (Summary of Annual Reports from 2004
4 through 2008 was marked for identification by
5 Mr. Armstrong as Board Exhibit No. 2.)
6 MR. ARMSTRONG: Is there anything
7 else from the board at this time?
8 This is a public hearing. It was a
9 continuation of last month's public hearing. There
10 was significant testimony or presentations by the
11 public at that time. You know, I don't think this
12 board needs to hear additional repetition of what's
13 already been testified to by the residents, but we
14 will open it up to the public for any new, any new,
15 any new comments or questions about the ordinance.
16 And I think we want to limit it to a certain amount
17 of time tonight.
18 MR. KEENER: I would hope we could
19 be done in 15 minutes.
20 MR. ARMSTRONG: So with that --
21 Sir?
22 MR. GREGORY PENCE: Greg Pence,
23 Pocono Manor and Pocono Township. Supervisor
24 Keener, at the last meeting you had said that you
25 wanted to look into the --
13
1 MR. ARMSTRONG: Let's do this,
2 Pocono Township?
3 MR. GREGORY PENCE: Yes.
4 MR. ARMSTRONG: Let's start with all
5 the Tobyhanna Township residents in the interest of
6 time this evening. You know, we've allowed Pocono
7 Township residents to come to the previous two
8 public hearings and we've been pretty forthcoming
9 with them, but for interest in time tonight let's
10 start with the Tobyhanna Township residents.
11 Is that fair?
12 Ma'am?
13 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Barbara
14 DeGeorge. I see the handwriting on the wall and I
15 don't want to deprive the township of, you know,
16 additional revenue. I get killed by my neighbors
17 just for openers, but I would like to see the
18 promises that Mr. Cahill made to the residents
19 nearby somehow enforced.
20 MR. ARMSTRONG: When and if --
21 Mr. Cahill can speak to this if he wants, but when
22 and if the property owner of that property comes
23 before the board with the land development
24 subdivision plan, whatever, to use that property in
25 the future, they're going to be coming before this
14
1 board and they're going to have to comply with all
2 the township subdivision and land development
3 ordinance requirements that are currently on the
4 books at the time of their proposed plan.
5 There have been no plans submitted
6 to the township thus far for this property. This
7 is -- you know, this is the township board of
8 supervisors' public hearing for considering the
9 rezoning of that property.
10 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Okay. So you
11 don't want to touch any of those issues?
12 MR. KEENER: I'll address it. And,
13 again, you're addressing the use, not the
14 particular zoning district.
15 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: No.
16 MR. KEENER: Yes, you are. Relative
17 to what would be required to buffer the property --
18 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Yes.
19 MR. KEENER: -- concerning the --
20 based on the current use that is there.
21 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Yes.
22 MR. KEENER: That is relative to the
23 use, not the zoning district itself. All right?
24 If, in fact, this does get changed to commercial,
25 within commercial there is provisions for
15
1 conditional uses for indoor and outdoor commercial
2 recreational uses subject to Section 155102, which
3 allows the supervisors to put specific
4 conditions -- which we've heard your testimony and
5 that is on the record and we will have that for our
6 consideration if a conditional use application is
7 made -- and within that they have to identify the
8 benefits to the township.
9 They have to address adequate
10 fencing, screening, or natural growth not less than
11 eight feet in height, where required by the board
12 of supervisors, shall be constructed or planted
13 around the perimeter of said parcel. All right?
14 Adequate sanitary facilities in accordance with the
15 rules and regulations of the DEP and the township.
16 The board of supervisors shall
17 determine, based on information and testimony
18 supplied at the hearing, that the use shall be
19 conducted in such a manner that the noise shall
20 comply with Section 15511Q and 15517G. So there
21 are specific regulations within the conditional use
22 part of the zoning ordinance that they would have
23 to comply with. And that will come back if, again,
24 they submit an application, there will be a public
25 hearing relative to the use.
16
1 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Fine. I'm
2 good.
3 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Diane Caldwell,
4 Tobyhanna Township. I'd like to address the report
5 from PennDOT as to the seven accidents that have
6 taken place. I'd like to know, number one, the
7 time span of those accidents.
8 MR. KEENER: 2004 to 2009.
9 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: I know. The
10 specific dates, like how many happened like within
11 a week's time, a month's time, a year's time.
12 Number two, where does PennDOT get their
13 information from? 'Cause I can honestly say with
14 my hand on a stack of bibles, I have witnessed this
15 year alone four accidents that have taken place on
16 the corner of Butz Lane and Sullivan Trail that the
17 police were called -- Deitz Lane and Sullivan Trail
18 that the police were called and had to pull
19 wreckages out from the woman who was here the last
20 meeting because they hydroplaned into her rocks and
21 actually moved them. And the girl was in critical
22 condition and hospitalized for several months and
23 almost died.
24 And there were three others prior to
25 that. So I don't know if it's the police records
17
1 are disclosed to PennDOT or how PennDOT's notified,
2 but we know that there's been more accidents that
3 have occurred than what's in that report.
4 MR. KERRICK: Excuse me, this only
5 goes to 2008, it doesn't have 2009.
6 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: But even in
7 2008 I know that there were at least five.
8 MR. KERRICK: They list zero.
9 MS. PICKARD: Reportable.
10 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Well, that's
11 what I'm saying, where do the reports come from?
12 'Cause if you contact Pocono Regional, they're the
13 ones that respond.
14 MR. KEENER: Can I read it to you?
15 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Sure.
16 MR. KEENER: All right. This e-mail
17 came from Christina Oswald who is the corps
18 liability specialist with PennDOT. It says, Dear
19 Jaime Keener: Attached is the documents on the
20 crash history of the area you specified. Crash
21 records in the Department of Transportation
22 repository come from crash records created by more
23 than 1200 police agencies across the Commonwealth.
24 Please be aware when using these
25 crash records that there may be inconsistencies in
18
1 how a crash is recorded. While the department
2 makes efforts to identify and correct errors, it
3 cannot attest to the accuracy of every value and
4 location provided in each individual crash record.
5 When reviewing these crash
6 histories, you should be aware of the definition of
7 a reportable accident in Pennsylvania. A
8 reportable accident is one in which an injury --
9 (Inaudible interruption.)
10 MR. KEENER: Excuse me.
11 A reportable accident is one in
12 which an injury or a fatality occurs or if at least
13 one of the vehicles involved requires towing from
14 the scene. Okay?
15 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Okay, but it
16 does stipulate that there are discrepancies in how
17 things are reported.
18 MR. KEENER: In how they're reported
19 but not that there is a report or not.
20 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: So there could
21 have been more accidents than what's listed there
22 through insurance reasons.
23 MR. KEENER: Do you have
24 documentation of it?
25 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: No, but I'd be
19
1 more than happy -- I make a motion to postpone the
2 meeting and get it from Pocono Regional.
3 MR. ARMSTRONG: Ma'am, the board has
4 a document from PennDOT showing how many crashes
5 that PennDOT has recorded on that particular span
6 of road.
7 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: But there's
8 discrepancies in it. And I live right there on
9 that corner. I know. I have videos to say that.
10 I know what has happened there.
11 MR. ARMSTRONG: Well, this board can
12 give this report from PennDOT the weight that they
13 feel it should be given.
14 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Well, don't I
15 have the right to get the report?
16 MR. ARMSTRONG: And you're providing
17 your comments right now.
18 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Well, I didn't
19 know what your report said for me to bring anything
20 with me tonight. I'd have to research it out and
21 present it to you.
22 MR. ARMSTRONG: Okay. Is there
23 anything --
24 MR. THOMAS CAMPSON: Just to add to
25 that -- Tom Campson -- there are a lot of accidents
20
1 that are property damage only where the police are
2 not called and the people just drive off. I just
3 want to make the board aware of that fact. And you
4 know people are intoxicated, they're not calling
5 the cops. Let's face facts, this is real life.
6 And I've seen a few cars ricochet off the boulders
7 on that corner. I've heard it, I go out and I look
8 and these people keep right on driving.
9 So, again, please take that into
10 consideration with that report. Thank you.
11 MR. ARMSTRONG: Anything else from
12 the public?
13 MR. RONALD MALVIN: Pocono Manor.
14 MR. ARMSTRONG: Pocono Township?
15 MR. RONALD MALVIN: Yes.
16 MR. ARMSTRONG: Is there any other
17 Tobyhanna Township resident at this time?
18 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Yep. It's me
19 again, Diane Caldwell.
20 I know that -- I'm not being -- I'm
21 not trying to be facetious nor am I trying to be
22 repetitious, but as it was stated before with the
23 quad park that's operating without proper
24 permitting, I'd ask in a motion to this board
25 tonight to look at that situation and put a cease
21
1 and desist to shut them down for operating
2 illegally.
3 MR. ARMSTRONG: I think -- correct
4 me if I'm wrong, I think the zoning officer for the
5 township has been probably looking into that
6 situation. I'm not sure if this -- the notice of
7 enforcement isn't going to come from the board, it
8 will come from the zoning officer.
9 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: Well, I spoke
10 to Mrs. Haas and she's not very cooperative and she
11 doesn't give any information out when you ask her a
12 question. So it has been very negative in the
13 responses that any one of us has received that's
14 called as to what the situation is gonna be with a
15 business that's operating illegally.
16 MR. ARMSTRONG: I can assure you
17 Mrs. Haas does her job pursuant to the zoning
18 ordinance.
19 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: I'm not saying
20 she's not doing her job. She's not very
21 cooperative.
22 MR. ARMSTRONG: And, again, I will
23 indicate that the ATV use isn't really what's
24 before the board right now. What's before the
25 board is the proposed rezoning of that parcel of
22
1 property from RR to C, commercial.
2 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: But I disagree
3 with you. When I see cars lined up at 7:30 in the
4 morning backing up traffic on Sullivan Trail which
5 prevents your view -- your line of sight coming
6 around certain curves where that's located, yes,
7 it's an issue and it needs to be looked at. And
8 then they open the gates at 8:00, they let
9 everybody in. There's no alternative parking here,
10 they just line up down Sullivan Trail waiting for
11 the park to open with hitches, quads and everything
12 else on there.
13 MR. ARMSTRONG: Okay. Is there any
14 other Tobyhanna Township resident that wants to
15 speak?
16 MR. THOMAS CAMPSON: Just a final
17 comment, sir. Thank you. It's just that it's nice
18 to see my friend Lance from Pocono Motor Sports is
19 developing his property. And across the street
20 from him, Locust Ridge, I believe, owns that
21 property across the way, which hopefully they're
22 gonna develop sometime in the near future.
23 So I don't know -- as far as the 940
24 corridor, I looked at the map there and I didn't
25 see much on that map as far as commercial that I
23
1 could see, but if I drive down 940, that corridor
2 is pretty much all commercial property from what
3 I've seen. So, I don't know if that map is
4 correct, but, again, like I said, from Long Pond
5 Road to Blakeslee Corners there's quite a bit of
6 industry along that route and there are a lot of
7 parcels that possibly may -- who knows in the
8 future, may be developed.
9 But as far as this zoning, I am dead
10 against it. I live within a thousand feet. I know
11 other comments from Emerald Lakes people that don't
12 live that close are for it, or whatever their
13 reasoning is, but they don't live within a thousand
14 feet where I do. I would like to poll the board
15 where they live and I'm sure that probably nobody
16 lives near where this question with the zoning is.
17 I thank you for your time.
18 MR. ARMSTRONG: Thank you, sir. Any
19 other Tobyhanna Township residents? No?
20 Do you want to open it up to Pocono
21 Township?
22 Any Pocono Township residents? Keep
23 it short, given the time tonight.
24 MR. GREGORY PENCE: Thank you.
25 First of all, I want to -- I appreciate that the
24
1 board's allowed residents from Pocono Township to
2 speak 'cause this, you know, concerns both of us
3 and I'm really appreciative of that. To get back
4 to where I was -- and my name is Greg Pence, Pocono
5 Manor, by the way.
6 Supervisor Keener, at the last
7 meeting you were gonna check into the tax benefit
8 to the township if the parcel was rezoned
9 commercial versus keeping it rural residential.
10 Do you have the figures?
11 MR. KEENER: I didn't get specific
12 numbers, but I will tell you, based on the report
13 that I submitted, anything nonresidential is a
14 benefit and anything residential is a deficit.
15 MR. GREGORY PENCE: Did you consider
16 the areas that are multiconservation areas as --
17 those would not be -- that would not be developed
18 as commercial?
19 MR. KEENER: In an R-2 zone, they
20 can develop residential uses -- right now they
21 could develop it as residential which would be a
22 tax deficit.
23 MR. GREGORY PENCE: And the Moth
24 Conservation Area. Is that in the Moth
25 Conservation Area?
25
1 MR. KEENER: Didn't consider that.
2 MR. GREGORY PENCE: Because it's
3 really not 193 acres, it's much less than that. If
4 you don't mind, if I can come up to the map here,
5 you're talking about basically this area in green.
6 This is the Moth Conservation Area right here.
7 This is a stream right here. So there's a
8 really -- there's not a whole lot of property there
9 that's available for commercial use.
10 And one of the problems also is
11 access to the property, because you cannot get
12 access to the property from Route 380. The only
13 way you can get access is from Sullivan Trail here,
14 which is already accessed. And really what Pocono
15 Manor may do in the future is develop this area up
16 here. But how do you get down here? There's a
17 stream, there's wetlands.
18 So I -- I think, you know, that
19 should be taken into consideration, that there
20 really is no access for really commercial
21 development, and the kind of commercial development
22 that they may be speaking about is sort of a pie in
23 the sky in that area.
24 Thank you.
25 MR. RONALD MALVIN: I'm Ronald
26
1 Malvin. I'm Pocono Manor, Pocono Township. I'd
2 like to read a statement, if you don't mind. I am
3 a resident of Pocono Manor and a member of the
4 Pocono Manor Cottage League, a social organization
5 consisting of property owners of the Pocono Manor
6 community. At a recent gathering on June 6, 2009,
7 it was requested by a majority of the members
8 present that I convey the collective sentiment of
9 that group that the zoning of the area under
10 consideration before this board remain unchanged as
11 a residential area and not changed to commercial
12 use.
13 The expression of the group ends
14 with this statement: It is admitted by the Pocono
15 Manor Investor Group that these are not times
16 conducive to their soon investing any additional
17 funds for the commercial substantial improvement of
18 the acreage in question. Hence, the potential of
19 increased tax revenues for Tobyhanna Township is
20 thereby greatly diminished. Further, before this
21 board in open hearings residents of Tobyhanna
22 Township have expressed their willingness to pay
23 increased taxes in order to avoid the compromised
24 exploitation and infringements upon their safety,
25 serenity, and pursuit of happiness.
27
1 The collection of increased taxes,
2 as stated by at least one board member, is the
3 impetus for the relentless consideration of this
4 change by this board. This is the third hearing on
5 this matter, as we understand it. This alone
6 evidences the severity of some of the problems
7 inherit to the issues and that some aver to
8 continued unlawful and unconscionable present use
9 and abuse of the area, as has been described at
10 length before this board.
11 The new owner/applicants, to our
12 knowledge, have to date offered not one legal and
13 binding commitment to run with the land nor have
14 they done any other public act to and for the
15 benefit of those affected by their presence that
16 would serve as an inducement to those who object in
17 this change, to change their minds and alter their
18 opinion as to this change.
19 There exists a flagrant violation of
20 the current zoning for this site at issue that this
21 board has not addressed -- an issue that this board
22 has not addressed. That violation has created
23 noise, pollution, environmental damage that impacts
24 not only the residents of Tobyhanna Township but
25 also Pocono Manor.
28
1 Accordingly, we ask that you, the
2 Tobyhanna Township Supervisors, vote no to this
3 change and in the least defer the matter until such
4 time as the issues that have been raised, of which
5 the board has been well aware, are completely,
6 comprehensibly addressed and resolved, and until
7 such time as there is presented a compelling and
8 timely justification for any change in zoning as
9 proposed.
10 Thank you.
11 MR. ARMSTRONG: Thank you.
12 Anything else from the board at this
13 time?
14 Okay. I think we can close the
15 public hearing.
16 Does the board wish to consider the
17 proposed ordinance?
18 MS. PICKARD: I make a motion that
19 we approve Ordinance No. 480.
20 MR. KEENER: Second.
21 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
22 Any questions or comments from the
23 board?
24 Questions or comments from the
25 public?
29
1 Yes, ma'am?
2 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: To sit here
3 after multiple meetings and to bring out all of the
4 factors that would be a ramification of this
5 rezoning, I just have one thing to say to
6 Mr. Keener. You made it very obvious that you were
7 all pro commercial to bring in the revenue to the
8 township, nothing about the safety of the residents
9 or our homes.
10 And just to keep in mind, if
11 Mr. Cahill goes ahead with that plan, he's talking
12 1100 homes and 150 condos. If one of those homes
13 each had a child, that would bring 1300 kids into
14 the school district. You're never gonna have
15 balance. You just make it commercial without
16 taking anything into consideration. And I really,
17 really, really am appalled at your decision. But
18 you did what you had intentions to do anyway, it
19 was a waste of our time.
20 MR. KEENER: I will say we represent
21 the whole township.
22 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: No, you don't.
23 MR. KERRICK: Any other comments,
24 questions?
25 MS. DIANE CALDWELL: No, you don't.
30
1 MR. KERRICK: Call the vote.
2 Jamie?
3 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
4 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
5 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
6 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
7 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
8 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
9 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
10 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
11 Motion carried.
12 Next item on the agenda, amend
13 zoning ordinance.
14 MR. ARMSTRONG: Yeah, I have another
15 proposed ordinance for your consideration this
16 evening. This one is also to the Zoning Ordinance
17 of Tobyhanna Township. This zoning ordinance is
18 proposing the --
19 (Discussion off the record.)
20 MR. ARMSTRONG: This ordinance is
21 proposing the amendment to the definition of land
22 development in the township's zoning ordinance.
23 Currently the definition of land development is not
24 consistent with the Pennsylvania Municipalities'
25 Planning Code and this ordinance will make it
31
1 consistent with the MPC. And the ordinance revises
2 the duties of the zoning officer, as well as the
3 requirement of the zoning permits to incorporate
4 not only the zoning ordinance but all other
5 township ordinances when considering a zoning
6 permit application.
7 It's been advertised with the Pocono
8 Record for a public hearing this evening, and it
9 was advertised on May 25, 2009 and June 1, 2009.
10 It's also been posted and available at the township
11 offices. It's been forwarded to the Monroe County
12 Planning Commission, as well as the township
13 planning commission. Both the county and the
14 township planning commission have recommended the
15 approval of this zoning ordinance. And it's before
16 you for a public hearing this evening.
17 Are there any questions or comments
18 from the board at this point?
19 Seeing none, it is advertised for a
20 public hearing, is there any public comment? We'll
21 open it up to public comment at this point.
22 Seeing none --
23 MR. KERRICK: Do we have a motion?
24 MR. KEENER: I make a motion we
25 approve Ordinance No. 481.
32
1 MR. ARMSTRONG: We can close the
2 hearing.
3 MR. KERRICK: I'm sorry, Jamie.
4 MR. KEENER: I'll make a motion we
5 approve Ordinance No. 481 relative to definition of
6 land development, duties of the zoning officer,
7 zoning permit requirements, and other provisions.
8 MR. KERRICK: Motion.
9 Do we have a second?
10 MS. PICKARD: I'll second the
11 motion.
12 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
13 Questions or comments from the
14 public?
15 Call the vote.
16 Jamie?
17 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
18 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
19 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
20 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
21 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
22 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
23 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
24 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
25 Motion carried.
33
1 Next item -- do you want to address
2 this?
3 MR. ARMSTRONG: Sure. The Hoffman
4 subdivision, I think it's, for now, just an
5 announcement. Subsequent to your last meeting,
6 they complied with all the conditions that were
7 available for them to complete; meaning, they still
8 just have to provide a deed consolidating the lots
9 that were part and parcel to the subdivision.
10 Obviously they couldn't do that
11 before recording the subdivision because there were
12 no second parcels to consolidate. We're still
13 waiting for that, but other than that all the
14 conditionals, to my knowledge, have been complied
15 with. And I believe the board signed and executed
16 the subdivision plans and they were probably
17 already recorded at the courthouse.
18 The Lake Naomi pedestrian agreement,
19 some of you may recall there was a grant
20 application for a grant to construct the pedestrian
21 path and bike path on Lake Naomi's property. Lake
22 Naomi provided the township with an access easement
23 for that pedestrian and bike path. We received an
24 executed copy of the grant application agreement
25 from Lake Naomi and it would be appropriate for the
34
1 township to consider approving this agreement
2 tonight.
3 MR. KERRICK: Do we have a motion?
4 MS. PICKARD: I make a motion we
5 approve the Lake Naomi pedestrian/bike path
6 agreement.
7 MR. MOYER: Second.
8 MR. KERRICK: Questions or comments
9 from the board.
10 Jamie, do you have any?
11 MR. KEENER: No.
12 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
13 MR. MOYER: No.
14 MR. KERRICK: Questions or comments
15 from the public?
16 Call the vote.
17 Jamie?
18 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
19 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
20 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
21 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
22 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
23 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
24 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
25 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
35
1 Motion carried.
2 Anything else, Pat?
3 MR. ARMSTRONG: The last thing on my
4 agenda is the bike path agreement. Again -- oh,
5 no, I already did that.
6 MR. KERRICK: We just did that one.
7 MR. ARMSTRONG: The only other thing
8 I have for execution tonight is the Block Course
9 Road and Route 423 maintenance agreement. You
10 previously approved Lake Naomi's proposal to add
11 some signage and paving markings and this is just a
12 maintenance agreement for that.
13 MR. KERRICK: Do we need a motion?
14 MR. ARMSTRONG: Sure.
15 MR. KERRICK: Can I have a motion to
16 enter into the agreement with Lake Naomi?
17 MR. MOYER: So moved.
18 MR. KERRICK: Is there a second?
19 MR. KEENER: I second.
20 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
21 Questions or comments from the
22 public?
23 Call the vote.
24 Jamie?
25 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
36
1 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
2 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
3 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
4 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
5 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
6 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
7 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
8 Motion carried.
9 MS. PICKARD: One quick question on
10 the bicycle/pedestrian path. Where are we at now
11 with sign --
12 MR. JEFF EVANS: We actually got a
13 sign-off from PennDOT on the bid documents. We're
14 waiting for a couple of the permits because the
15 amount of time expired, so we're just waiting for
16 renewal. We're working with DEP on those, and we
17 see no reason that this can't be accomplished
18 hopefully before the end of 2009. Our goal is to
19 get everything completed and get it out to bid with
20 our approval by the end of the summer to be
21 constructed this fall.
22 MS. PICKARD: But we have to
23 advertise that, right?
24 MR. JEFF EVANS: Right, right.
25 PennDOT won't sign off allowing us to advertise it
37
1 because then you have the bids until the permits
2 are in hand, so we're working with DEP on that.
3 MR. KERRICK: Do you have a
4 question?
5 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Yes. It
6 sounds like we're entering into a maintenance
7 agreement for a road that is going down to -- that
8 belongs to Lake Naomi?
9 MR. ARMSTRONG: You know --
10 MR. KERRICK: Go ahead, you can
11 explain it.
12 MR. ARMSTRONG: What it is, is it's
13 actually a state and private road, right? And Lake
14 Naomi wanted to place some signage and some
15 pavement signage to actually slow traffic at that
16 intersection. And the township, what this
17 maintenance agreement is saying is that Lake
18 Naomi's responsible for the maintenance of those
19 signs and the road pavings -- or not -- the
20 pavement markings.
21 MR. KERRICK: Do we have anything on
22 the -- is your question answered on the bike path?
23 MR. ARMSTRONG: That's all I have
24 for my report.
25 MR. KERRICK: Thank you.
38
1 Next item on our agenda, new
2 business, lands of Route 940, LLC, Pocono Motor
3 Sports land development plan and stormwater
4 maintenance agreement.
5 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Good evening.
6 I'm Mark Robbins, I'm presenting the plan.
7 Mr. Lance Mirkin is in the audience, the owner as
8 well. I guess to date the plan that you're looking
9 at, the land development, Sheet 1, to date has
10 been -- we have addressed the planning commission's
11 comments, the engineer's comments, and Guardian's
12 comments, fire chief's concerns, and also the
13 stormwater maintenance agreement has been
14 completed. I know it was signed by the owner, I
15 believe it's in your office. I think at this time
16 we just need to take care of the development
17 agreement and more specifically within that
18 development agreement is the issue with the
19 reserved septic area.
20 I do understand, and if I could at
21 least make another request, we did submit in
22 January a waiver request and since then I
23 understand there has been more work done on the
24 possibility of central sewer going through. We
25 were hoping that in light of this moving forward,
39
1 you know, that could hopefully make this a little
2 bit easier on the expense, I guess I'll have to
3 say, of bringing in thousands of dollars of fill
4 for a system that may not be used. I just want to
5 bring that in front of the board first, if that's
6 possible for consideration.
7 Mr. Armstrong, is there anything
8 else that we need to address other than this?
9 MR. ARMSTRONG: The latest
10 engineer's review letter is May 18, 2009 and it
11 sounded like you have complied with or addressed
12 most of the issues in that letter. There is that
13 sanitary sewer issue with respect to the reserved
14 location. I believe the applicant had previously
15 proposed the four-year fill procedure, at which
16 point the board didn't take official action on but
17 indicated that the board would consider it.
18 That seems to be the major issue at
19 this point, if the board's agreeable to that
20 reserved location for that four-year fill. The
21 only thing I would add is that the development
22 agreement, if that is the way the board takes
23 action tonight or in the months to come, that the
24 procedures be set forth in the development
25 agreement or that the applicant be required to
40
1 provide a -- I don't know if it would be like a
2 soil scientist to confirm that the four-year fill
3 procedure is done properly.
4 But all of this can be done within
5 the development agreement if the board wants to
6 move forward with this plan this evening.
7 Obviously some of the conditions in the development
8 agreement concerning the sewage system would be --
9 in the event that it would fail, what we would do
10 in the event that the holding tank is required in
11 order to -- in the event that the primary system
12 would fail before the four-year fill procedure was
13 completed, that there was some kind of a backup
14 plan for the applicant at that point.
15 As I said, there should be a soil
16 scientist to prepare and submit a detailed fill
17 plan proposal to the township with respect to
18 financial security for that financial -- or the
19 four-year fill procedure. I think it would be
20 appropriate to ask the applicant to provide some
21 kind of a cost estimate with respect to that;
22 meaning the design, the construction and the
23 maintenance of that four-year fill.
24 I'm obviously not an engineer so I'm
25 not going to tell you how much I think -- I don't
41
1 know if Bob has indicated any numbers, but it would
2 probably be appropriate for the applicant to
3 provide some kind of a cost estimate for it.
4 And just on that same note, I
5 believe the applicant did provide a cost estimate
6 for the improvements. I think Bob McHale, the
7 township engineer, had a response to that
8 indicating that he doesn't believe it contained all
9 of the required improvements in that cost estimate,
10 so that will also have to be addressed by the
11 applicant.
12 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Okay. Yeah, we
13 didn't add the building aspects into that, which we
14 can add. I just want to make sure that, you know,
15 we are moving in that direction, that we do want to
16 have this four-year fill. Is that --
17 MR. MOYER: Yeah.
18 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Okay. So, yeah,
19 I can get an estimate of -- by the size of it, how
20 much it will cost. We'll be using DelVal soil
21 scientists; we've been involved with them probably
22 for 20 years on fill sites. As long as they're
23 there to oversee it -- I've never seen a four-year
24 fill that didn't qualify after its time period.
25 But they -- I can also get an estimate from them on
42
1 what their end of it will cost and add that into
2 the estimate.
3 MR. ARMSTRONG: It will probably be
4 appropriate also to -- I mean, this is all going to
5 be most likely provisions in the development
6 agreement so we don't have to go into detail
7 tonight.
8 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Okay.
9 MR. ARMSTRONG: But I'm assuming
10 there's going to be some kind of a reporting aspect
11 to this where you'll take soil samples and provide
12 them to the township or Bob throughout the
13 four-year fill to see if it looks like it's going
14 to be meeting, you know, whatever standards you
15 have to meet.
16 MR. MARK ROBBINS: You mean during
17 the four-year period?
18 MR. ARMSTRONG: Yeah.
19 MR. MARK ROBBINS: That isn't how it
20 works. You're supposed to wait until it settles
21 for four years before you test it.
22 MR. ARMSTRONG: Okay.
23 MR. MARK ROBBINS: And at that point
24 you're looking for the deposit results.
25 MR. KERRICK: You know my opinion,
43
1 if DelVal would work with John Brogan, I believe
2 they could come up with a satisfactory arrangement.
3 MS. PICKARD: We did have one that
4 failed four years this week or last week.
5 MR. MARK ROBBINS: I don't know if
6 DelVal was -- I know which one you're talking about
7 and DelVal was not involved with that. Actually,
8 just down the street from that one, DelVal was
9 involved with that one and that one did pass. So
10 we need them.
11 MR. ARMSTRONG: But the applicant
12 has executed the stormwater easement and
13 agreements. Did you include those additional plans
14 that the planning commission was looking for in
15 their revised plans? I'm assuming you did.
16 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Yes.
17 MR. ARMSTRONG: So it looks like the
18 main -- if I'm understanding this situation, the
19 main issue is this four-year fill?
20 MR. MARK ROBBINS: That's the
21 direction, yes. If I knew for sure the direction
22 we were going to go with, that we get those
23 estimates together, I can talk to John Brogan again
24 and update the form that your engineer for
25 estimates had those items in. And, I guess, at
44
1 that point get that information to you for the
2 development agreement. Actually, I'm not a hundred
3 percent clear we're gonna go with the four-year
4 fill, but also we need language to address if the
5 primary system fails before the four years, the
6 holding tanks and --
7 MR. ARMSTRONG: Yeah, there's going
8 to have to be something in there in the event that
9 you do fail the primary system before the
10 four-year. I'm assuming a holding tank for a
11 certain amount of time; but if things can't get
12 rectified, you know, there's going to be the
13 potential there for revoking of the C of O until
14 you can actually resolve the problem. And that's a
15 big what if, but it should be addressed.
16 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Yeah, okay. But
17 that's something you'll want to have in the
18 agreement.
19 Well, that gives me direction.
20 MR. KERRICK: What's the board's
21 pleasure? You want to take action on this, this
22 evening?
23 MS. LAMBERTON: Yeah.
24 MS. PICKARD: I make a motion that
25 we approve the land development plan for Pocono
45
1 Motor Sports land development plan of Route 940,
2 LLC, our project No. 2008-016, subject to the
3 comments in our township engineer's review letter
4 of May 18 and subject to entering into the
5 development agreement with the appropriate
6 financial securities and addressing the relief
7 septic area. Also subject to waivers of SALDO
8 Section 135-12.D(2), and SALDO 135-15.A(15), and
9 SALDO Section 135-17(L) and (M).
10 There's a note here about three
11 street trees to be added along the frontage of
12 Route 940?
13 MR. MARK ROBBINS: That was
14 completed for the final landscaping.
15 MR. KERRICK: Motion on the floor.
16 Do we have a second?
17 MR. MOYER: Second.
18 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
19 Questions or comments from the
20 board?
21 Questions or comments from the
22 public on the motion?
23 Call the vote.
24 Jamie?
25 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
46
1 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
2 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
3 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
4 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
5 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
6 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
7 MR. KERRICK: I'll vote in favor.
8 Motion carried. Thank you.
9 MR. MARK ROBBINS: Thank you very
10 much.
11 MR. KERRICK: Next item on our
12 agenda, Toby/Tunkhannock memorandum of
13 understanding, township pool.
14 Heidi?
15 MS. PICKARD: This was an agreement
16 that Pat spoke about. We were asked by Tunkhannock
17 to have the agreement made which just really states
18 that Tunkhannock Township has the right this year
19 to join our pool, subject to our fees, waive those
20 of any liability and indemnifies us. And it
21 expires at the end of this year. (Inaudible) state
22 needs to register, pay fees to Tunkhannock before
23 we have to abide by the rules.
24 I'll make a motion that we approve
25 the memorandum of understanding for the township
47
1 pool, 2009.
2 MR. KERRICK: Motion on the floor.
3 Do we have a second?
4 MR. MOYER: Second.
5 MR. KERRICK: Questions or comments
6 from the board?
7 Questions or comments from the
8 public?
9 Call the vote.
10 Jamie?
11 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
12 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
13 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
14 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
15 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
16 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
17 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
18 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
19 Motion carried.
20 Next item on our agenda, Resolution
21 2009-016, Keystone Opportunity Expansion Zone, New
22 Ventures Park in Blakeslee.
23 MS. PICKARD: We had gotten an
24 e-mail from Dennis Newman from the Pocono Mountain
25 Economic Development Group, that forwarded an
48
1 e-mail from DCED, that they had some issues with
2 our resolution that we had done previously. And
3 they asked for some changes. I think Pat could
4 explain more specifically.
5 MR. ARMSTRONG: Yeah, the changes
6 they were looking for were, one, to designate an
7 actual percentage in Provision No. 3 rather than a
8 to-be-determined percentage. So what we did was we
9 included the statutory percentage of 110 percent.
10 And, again, that is for -- I could
11 read the provision: It shall be a requirement and
12 condition of this resolution that an agreement be
13 entered into between the township and the
14 business/property owner located within the proposed
15 Keystone Opportunity Expansion Zone requiring
16 110 percent of the amount of real property taxes
17 payable for the tax year immediately prior to the
18 year in which the designation of extension is
19 granted be paid to the township. Previously it had
20 a to-be-determined percentage, we used the
21 statutory language of 110 percent.
22 And also in No. 2, we previously had
23 a provision in there that the applicant designate a
24 certain percentage of the use. It's not in here
25 now, but I think it was the real estate tax to be
49
1 reinvested into the property. It's my
2 understanding that the county did not want to see
3 that in there. It's my understanding it's a new
4 provision in the statute and they didn't feel
5 comfortable including it in the resolution, so that
6 was taken out.
7 MS. PICKARD: This would repeal
8 Resolution 2009-11?
9 MR. ARMSTRONG: Right. It repeals
10 that resolution and it readopts the majority of it
11 with those two changes.
12 MS. PICKARD: Well, then I'll make a
13 motion that we approve Resolution 2009-016,
14 Keystone Opportunity Expansion Zone, New Ventures.
15 MR. KERRICK: We have a motion on
16 the floor.
17 Do we have a second?
18 MR. MOYER: Second.
19 MR. KERRICK: Questions or comments
20 from the public on the motion?
21 Call the vote.
22 Jamie?
23 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
24 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
25 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
50
1 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
2 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
3 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
4 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
5 MR. KERRICK: And I'll vote in
6 favor. Motion carried.
7 Next item, proclamation for Barrett
8 Township celebration sesquicentennial.
9 MS. PICKARD: 150th celebration.
10 You want to read the proclamation?
11 We were asked by the Barrett
12 Historical Society to see if we wanted to submit a
13 proclamation for their time capsule. Basically it
14 says we're one of their neighboring communities in
15 the County of Monroe and they were established in
16 1859 consisting of Cresco, Canadensis,
17 Mountainhome, Buck Hill Falls, and Skytop.
18 And the historical association and
19 its members will hold a special week-long event in
20 the commemoration of the 150th anniversary of the
21 municipality of Barrett Township. And that the
22 celebration will prove to be a great opportunity
23 for residents, business people, and community
24 leaders to share and commemorate the rich heritage
25 of the community. And the Township of Tobyhanna
51
1 congratulates the citizens of Barrett Township on
2 their 150 years, from 1859 to 2009,
3 sesquicentennial celebration.
4 So I will move that we adopt the
5 proclamation.
6 MR. KEENER: Second.
7 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
8 Questions or comments from the
9 public?
10 Call the vote.
11 Jamie?
12 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
13 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
14 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
15 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
16 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
17 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
18 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
19 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
20 Motion carried.
21 Next item we have is proposed zoning
22 ordinance amendment for Mount Pocono. Pat said we
23 do not need a motion, we don't even have to comment
24 if we so choose.
25 MR. ARMSTRONG: Yeah, what this is,
52
1 is, as you may recall, the regional comp
2 implementation agreement requires every
3 municipality to provide the member municipalities
4 with copies of the proposed zoning ordinance and
5 SALDO ordinance amendments. And this is what Mount
6 Pocono is doing. You can comment if you'd like. I
7 think the planning commission looked at it and I
8 think they may make a comment at next month's
9 meeting.
10 MR. MOYER: Yeah.
11 MR. ARMSTRONG: I think they'll
12 probably be taking action on it. Not this planning
13 commission but Mount Pocono is probably going to
14 take action on it next month. So it will just be
15 cutting it close to that meeting.
16 MR. KERRICK: Keep in mind that it's
17 going to be revisited as we're going through the
18 regional zoning ordinance modification with Mount
19 Pocono, Coolbaugh, and Tunkhannock Township, so
20 that might be part of our revision as well.
21 MS. PICKARD: Exactly. And I think
22 a lot of this we'll be going through and taking a
23 look at ourselves; our lot consolidation, we had
24 some issues with. So if we have any comments, if
25 the planning commission felt strongly, should we
53
1 forward those on to Mount Pocono?
2 MR. ARMSTRONG: Absolutely.
3 MS. PICKARD: Okay. We don't need a
4 motion for that?
5 MR. ARMSTRONG: No.
6 MS. PICKARD: Okay. So if you come
7 up with some comments, we're going to forward them.
8 MR. KERRICK: Pat had a question for
9 us. When we discussed the wood burner at last
10 month's -- or the last work session, what did we
11 direct him to -- adjust the height or the size or
12 are we gonna discuss it some more? He needs some
13 direction. I don't --
14 MR. ARMSTRONG: I mean, I can hold
15 off, if you'd like. I sent out a letter to PSATS,
16 I think, last week. I don't know if that's
17 something you guys want to consider. If you want
18 to think about it some more, that's up to the
19 board.
20 MR. MOYER: Yeah. I think we should
21 think about it some more.
22 MR. KERRICK: We didn't really
23 discuss the lot size.
24 MS. PICKARD: We sent about five
25 different ordinances as well and I haven't had a
54
1 chance to look at them. I can send them out. I
2 think where we were looking at, if you were beyond
3 the 300 feet, then we weren't really worried about
4 the stack height --
5 MR. ARMSTRONG: For the setback
6 distance.
7 MS. PICKARD: For the setback
8 distance. And then we talked about that, depending
9 if it didn't meet the setbacks and it was a certain
10 size then, that was yet to be determined, we would
11 permit a sign-off from the neighbors.
12 MR. ARMSTRONG: Okay.
13 MR. KERRICK: Then I guess at our
14 next work session we'll revisit the 167?
15 MS. PICKARD: July.
16 MR. KERRICK: Bring all that
17 information.
18 MS. PICKARD: Do we need to meet
19 with the planning commission again or do we want
20 to --
21 MR. KEENER: I think the planning
22 commission is pretty well-rested on the
23 organization --
24 MR. KERRICK: They gave us their
25 comments.
55
1 Does any other member have anything
2 to discuss before I open it up to the public?
3 MS. PICKARD: I just had one comment
4 on --
5 MR. KERRICK: Do you have anything?
6 MR. ARMSTRONG: Uh-uh.
7 MS. PICKARD: -- and that was just
8 about the pool. I needed to get an advertisement
9 for the sign-up dates. Originally we were
10 advertising that the sign-ups start this Friday,
11 but we weren't able to get anything in. I was
12 wondering whether or not we had any definitive
13 direction on the drain cover.
14 MR. KERRICK: To the best of my
15 knowledge, it's resolved. I don't have
16 confirmation on that, but I don't think it's a
17 problem if you advertise.
18 Public have anything they'd like to
19 address the board?
20 MR. BUZ WHELAN: I do.
21 MR. KERRICK: Sir? Name for the
22 record, please.
23 MR. BUZ WHELAN: My name is Buz
24 Whelan. I'm the president of Emerald Lakes Board
25 of Directors. Distinguished supervisors,
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1 solicitor, and I rise not to preach but to beseech.
2 We're planning an Emerald Lakes Day for July 25,
3 games, prizes, cook-off, all kinds of events kept
4 by, we had hoped, a fireworks display. We engaged
5 a professional fireworks provider. We have a
6 number of volunteer firefighters in our community
7 who said they could ensure that there was a fire
8 fighting unit present. The fireworks were slated
9 to be set out over a lake and we went to get a
10 permit and were told that we needed a million
11 dollar bond.
12 Now, we have two million dollars
13 worth of insurance and a ten million dollar
14 umbrella policy, and I'm sure that the fireworks
15 provider also is insured. We're doing it in a safe
16 manner using a professional provider; as a matter
17 of fact, the same provider that does Coolbaugh
18 Township fireworks. And we're setting them out
19 over a lake. We could do it somewhere else because
20 Tunkhannock doesn't have that requirement, but we
21 thought the most responsible thing would be to set
22 it out over a lake. And all four of our lakes that
23 have public access are located in Tobyhanna.
24 So I think what I'm asking you is to
25 suspend that requirement providing that we prove
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1 that we have adequate insurance, that a
2 professional is doing the display, and that we will
3 have fire fighting backups present at the time.
4 We're trying to act responsible.
5 The ironic thing here is that I am
6 directly across the lake from Pine Tree Beach and
7 every July 4 somebody, armatures, set off all kinds
8 of aerial bombs and, you know, the regular --
9 everybody's got a cousin Vinny from Brooklyn or
10 Dwayne from Plainfield who goes to Phantom
11 Fireworks, using their out-of-state license, buys
12 all the things that we can't buy and sets them off
13 in our community. And nothing is ever done. Here
14 we're trying to do something responsibly.
15 Now, let me tell you, a million
16 dollar bond costs $10,000. That means we can't do
17 it. The fireworks display themselves are only
18 3,000 because we're doing it off-peak, July 25.
19 This is a display that would cost us 6 or 7,000 on
20 July 4; but because we're doing it off-peak, we're
21 gonna save some money and we can afford to do it.
22 But in these times we can't afford a $10,000 bond
23 for one night.
24 So what I'm asking you is, can you
25 consider some sort of a motion that would absolve
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1 us for this one day from this requirement, or you
2 would look at your requirement and decide that
3 maybe this is unreasonable, maybe that people who
4 are trying to be responsible -- we're good
5 Americans here, I'm a veteran, you know, fireworks
6 are an American thing. And so, you know, that's
7 what we're looking for: Can you give us a break
8 here and let us set off the fireworks? You're all
9 invited, of course.
10 So is this something that you would
11 consider? Do you think I'm being reasonable here?
12 MR. KEENER: You said your current
13 insurance coverage is what?
14 MR. BUZ WHELAN: We have $2 million
15 worth of insurance but a ten million dollar
16 umbrella policy for all possible things that would
17 go wrong. Also our insurance provider, by the way,
18 has been in e-mail contact with your clerk.
19 MS. BARBARA DeGEORGE: Broker.
20 MR. BUZ WHELAN: Broker. And has
21 been in e-mail contact with your clerk who has said
22 she is considering waiving the requirement, but you
23 guys have the power. You know what I mean? You
24 guys can actually do it.
25 MR. ARMSTRONG: The ten million
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1 dollar bond, when we were putting it together, that
2 actually came -- it's a suggestion from PSATS, the
3 Pennsylvania State Association of Township
4 Supervisors. That's where that number came from.
5 MR. BUZ WHELAN: I understand that.
6 MR. KEENER: Can they put us on as
7 additional insured?
8 MR. BUZ WHELAN: You're not bound by
9 that. You decide whether you want to accept that
10 or not.
11 MR. ARMSTRONG: Right.
12 MR. KEENER: Can they put us on
13 their policy as additional insured just for this
14 specific --
15 MR. ARMSTRONG: I would recommend if
16 the board wants to consider not requiring a bond --
17 MR. BUZ WHELAN: Our broker says
18 that for a binder for that night, if you wanted a
19 specific binder, we're talking in the hundreds of
20 dollars rather than the tens of thousands. So, I
21 mean, in other words, we're gonna do this in a safe
22 way and we're gonna provide coverage just in case.
23 MR. ARMSTRONG: And you're going to
24 provide --
25 MR. BUZ WHELAN: But when you say a
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1 million dollar bond, you've gone from prudence to
2 the punitive. You know what I mean? It's
3 impossible.
4 MR. KERRICK: Well, we did one for
5 Lake Naomi not so long ago. Why would we treat
6 them any different from Lake Naomi?
7 MS. PICKARD: He just said this
8 fireworks ordinance, we changed it last year.
9 MR. ARMSTRONG: And we haven't done
10 it in three or four years.
11 MR. KERRICK: But when you did it,
12 it was no --
13 MR. ARMSTRONG: Right. There was no
14 requirement for a bond. There was a requirement
15 for insurance coverage --
16 MR. BUZ WHELAN: Which we will
17 prove.
18 MR. ARMSTRONG: -- as they're
19 speaking about, but I think you changed the
20 ordinance in the meantime.
21 MS. PICKARD: But it was PSATS where
22 we got the one million dollar bond.
23 MR. KERRICK: That's a suggestion.
24 That doesn't mean we have to follow it.
25 MS. PICKARD: I don't think anybody
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1 realized that it would be that costly.
2 MR. KEENER: In lieu of their
3 request, it would be prudent for us to be put on as
4 additional insured for that specific event.
5 MR. JEFF EVANS: I think you
6 required that in the past with the -- other
7 communities have done it.
8 MR. BUZ WHELAN: We'd be happy to do
9 that.
10 MR. ARMSTRONG: Yeah, I don't have a
11 problem with that.
12 MR. KEENER: Is that a waiverable --
13 MS. PICKARD: That one item. I
14 don't know what all the other --
15 MR. BUZ WHELAN: And we're only for
16 one day, July 25. We're not looking for a
17 blanket --
18 MR. KEENER: Is that the only issue
19 that you have relative to the ordinance? Are there
20 other specific --
21 MR. BUZ WHELAN: Yep, we're in
22 compliance in every other way.
23 MR. KEENER: I make a motion that we
24 waive the bond requirement subject to them
25 including Tobyhanna Township as additional insured
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1 in their current insurance.
2 MS. PICKARD: And that's a two
3 million dollar to ten million --
4 MR. BUZ WHELAN: You asked for a
5 million, I say we are overinsured.
6 MR. KEENER: And that would be for
7 July the 25th?
8 MR. BUZ WHELAN: Correct.
9 MS. PICKARD: Motion.
10 MR. KERRICK: Motion on the floor.
11 Do we have a second?
12 MR. MOYER: Second.
13 MR. KERRICK: Motion and second.
14 Questions or comments?
15 Questions or comments from the
16 public?
17 Call the vote.
18 Jamie?
19 MR. KEENER: I vote in favor.
20 MR. KERRICK: Anne?
21 MS. LAMBERTON: I vote in favor.
22 MR. KERRICK: Donny?
23 MR. MOYER: I vote in favor.
24 MR. KERRICK: Heidi?
25 MS. PICKARD: I vote in favor.
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1 MR. KERRICK: I vote in favor.
2 Motion carried. Thank you.
3 MR. BUZ WHELAN: I'll make sure my
4 voters know this.
5 MR. KEENER: And your neighbors.
6 MR. KERRICK: Anyone else wish to
7 address the board?
8 MR. ERIC WOEFULL: Eric Woefull. On
9 April 24 of this year I sent a letter to the board
10 of supervisors just asking for an update on the 537
11 Plan. If you could give me any idea where we are
12 with the 537 Plan and when it would be completed.
13 MR. KERRICK: We just had this
14 conversation, Eric. You want it on the record?
15 MR. ERIC WOEFULL: Yes.
16 MR. KERRICK: Oh, okay. At the
17 present time we are collecting our water samples.
18 I'm not sure how many we had, the total.
19 MS. PICKARD: They're working on it.
20 MR. KERRICK: They're working on it.
21 The last month we've been working on it extensively
22 and hopefully in another few weeks we should have
23 that resolved.
24 MR. KEENER: When was the meeting
25 with DEP? About a month and a half ago or so?
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1 Just to get direction from them.
2 MS. PICKARD: That was on Arrowhead.
3 MR. KEENER: Oh, that's right.
4 MS. PICKARD: October, we --
5 MR. KERRICK: We had a meeting in
6 October, but they didn't give us direction. And
7 then this spring we decided that we would move
8 forward to get it resolved without direction. So I
9 would say that we're -- hopefully by the end of the
10 summer we would be completed.
11 Does that answer your question?
12 MR. ERIC WOEFULL: Yes.
13 MR. KERRICK: That's pretty much
14 what I told you last week.
15 MR. ERIC WOEFULL: Thank you.
16 MR. JEFF EVANS: Did you get the
17 second check from the 940 sewage?
18 MS. PICKARD: I believe we did.
19 Thank you.
20 MR. KERRICK: Anyone else?
21 Mr. Schurr?
22 MR. FREDERICK SCHURR: Yeah. A
23 while back I protested an increase in the sewer. I
24 thought the rate was very high. Now, I had -- I
25 got some information, thank you. And I saw in the
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1 Plateau transcript of the meeting -- now, I notice
2 that that wasn't even mentioned in the Plateau.
3 Now, I don't know whether that's you people cut it
4 out or the Plateau cut it out.
5 MR. KERRICK: Mr. Schurr, we don't
6 control what they print.
7 MR. FREDERICK SCHURR: I know that.
8 I know that. I know that, but it was in as if it
9 was a complete transcript.
10 MR. KERRICK: I didn't even see it
11 so I can't even speak for it. Does anyone else
12 wish to address it? Anything else you have for us?
13 MR. FREDERICK SCHURR: Well, I guess
14 I want to say I think that it's kept back from the
15 people, that we're getting that kind of a raise.
16 120 bucks is a lot of money.
17 MR. KERRICK: Every bill on the last
18 quarter, it was announced of the increase, every
19 bill that went out. So it was publically noted
20 that it went out, the increase. We did not
21 increase the fees for over ten years.
22 MR. FREDERICK SCHURR: That's no
23 problem about the fees. I'm saying people weren't
24 notified that much. There was nothing in the
25 paper. I couldn't find anything about it. That's
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1 all I have to say about it.
2 MR. KERRICK: Thank you, Mr. Schurr.
3 Anyone else? One? Twice? Thank
4 you for coming.
5 (Meeting concluded at 8:15 p.m.)
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7 I hereby certify that the
8 proceedings and evidence are contained fully and
9 accurately, to the best of my ability, in the notes
10 taken by me at the meeting in the above matter; and
11 that the foregoing is a true and correct transcript
12 of the same.
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15 ______________________
16 EVILYS E. BRATHWAITE
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